Ok, I know my songs are not perfect, but does anybody know if just the judges critique the songs, or do other members here critique them too?
If other members can critique the songs too, than you can tell who is the professional judge from the pathetic amateur musician because I have been getting professionally worded critiques, and also very harsh uncalled for words from others about my music. Whoever it is that has the nerve to leave someone really offensive feedback should look at they're own music first before they talk trash to others. My music is experimental with lots of synthesizers, and there is some ignorant musicians out there that does not understand what "experimental" music is. I guess they are too trendy and busy with the mainstream typical sounding music out there to keep an open mind. Or maybe they just lack the brainpower.
the criticism i recieved here was so harsh that I saught treatment and now my therapist says I should begin the healing process!! I've quit playing music and now specialize in wicker furniture. It's relaxing but somewhat short on the auditory senses! My advice is A, understand that all members here are allowed to post comments, it's sounds like this is a feature you haven't participated in since you're asking who does the judging, B, occassionally, and I do mean occassionally, one of the "pro" judges will add a comment, and C, get used to criticism! It comes from all quarters and you should understand who to listen to and who to ignore! I have posted many songs here in the past that I thought were very good and have, at times, recieved great reviews and, at other times, have been pummeled! Learn to live with it all because it will either teach you about your abilities or give you a better understanding of how you should treat the works of others!! Can't we all just get along!?
JL DDATB If you're not living on the edge You're taking up too much space!!
oh, that is so terrible that you had to take up making wicker furniture. Awwww. I'm sure everything will be okay.....
pfft. anyway, from your advice from what you had mentioned to me: for your lettered advice from before: A. I now know that other members can leave comments. I originally was under the impression that it was just a "pro" from the website company. -I'm new to this site, ya see ?
B. Occasionally the pros sometimes leave comments. Ok, now that clearifies some of my original quesiton.
C. I can deal with negative criticism. But I will not put up with "below the belt" comments from other members. Its easy for them to sit on a keyboard and type horrible trash talk, but I bet they would not have the nerve to say in person, what they had left as a comment for my songs. Members like that have "no class". If they said they dislike it, fine. Its they're opinion. But for them to blow it up and get they're rocks off by being a complete trash bag with what they say to me, then they are not a professional musician like they think they are.
"C. I can deal with negative criticism. But I will not put up with "below the belt" comments from other members. "
In the effort to achieve illumination....oh no you can't and oh yes you will:) That JL, myself, you and those surely to follow, are even involved in this topic...again... is proof that someone touched something inside you that now you try to avoid looking at directly. Songs are our babies and are very personal in nature, no matter the genre, to the "creator." It is difficult to look at a statement like "... your singing that got you thrown into the well ..." and "...no sense of rhythym" or "...keyboards really kill this song" not only because it is in small purple print with poor spelling but they are directed at you. The trick is to not let yer knee jerk. First impressions are hard to live on and even harder to keep up.
"If they said they dislike it, fine. Its they're opinion."
This is where you should take yer own advice. It is exactly and ONLY that.
These folks can smell blood, boss. And fear. You put the two together and you become just another wicker accident waiting to happen.
this site is designed to encourage knee jerk reactions. when you send your music to an A&R guy, do you expect him to brood over your music and look for deep hidden meanings? this site is by no means kind, but it is reality.
True that your mother doesn't rate songs here,so you won't get the "oh that was lovely dear" you may have come to expect.
The feedback here is gloves off (with a few exceptions) and the closest thing to real you'll get for free. Honestly, it would take a real sadist to pay for this...
you know helter, I feel for you. I really don't understand why the bitter spirit of competition that exists in the so called "real world" of music gets bled over into the comments section, regardless of how it has little/no effect on the outcome of the so called "contest" (which is little more than a badge to wear that no one will recognize anyway.) the truth is this page is dedicated to a wide variety of artists, all of which are dedicated to mainstream stardom/mimicking the perfect structure of template crap you hear on the radio everyday, so that we can hear more about getting some action, stupid girlfriends and irresponsibility of stars' lifestyle's (or whatever the stupid things are they song about in pop music these days.) That being said, its a "reality" that you'll get people who don't appreciate your creative endeavours, and the other reality is that people that hide behind screen names have no reason to be professional, or accountable for there words. Thats why, in my opinion, you get so idiotic things like, "whatever you're doing, it isn't working" or whatever other retarded and absolutely moronic things people decide they want to type in the anonymous feedback box. as for professional feedback, i doubt if you got any, you probably got another submitter that is actually prefessional about the responsibility of telling someone else what they think of their efforts, and left a good reveiw. this site isn't any more "reality" than a bunch of childish quibbling is reality. reality is that people are immature, and you'll need to look further to get better feedback. I would suggest garageband.com or sonicbids, or simply playing live shows and asking other bands for feedback, or collaberating and seeing what the other people take to and what they don't like, making friends with real musicians at shows and directing them to this site, or sending them mp3's. it ALWAYS helps to give them good, in depth positive and negative feedback before asking them for feedback. finally, stay within your genre. People outside it rarely appreciate it unless it is considered "radio friendly" which generally means stripped of all originality and overproduced, or mixed with poppy melodies and steady bass drum jamband 3/4 time rythms. raw originality is the crux of real music, and the only way to make music worth existing, but not everybody gets that you know? anyway, don't worry that so many people feel it their obligation to put you down so they can feel better about their own music, its not new to this site, or anywhere there is one big genre pool. tsote
thanks gavinbas for your reply. at least someone on this website agrees with me and sees it how i see it. the unprofessionalism of the so called "professionals" on this site is pathetic. they make it like that have to direct the comments at the musician on a personal level, and instead of actually doing a critique of what they feel needs work, they just say what they do not like about a song, and say it as a deliberate insult. I honestly feel that they are just so miserable with they're lives, that they love to be horrific with what they leave as a comment for a musician. most of the bands and artists on here sound alike. they are either acoustic, or blues. my music is far from that genre. i have already went to garageband.com and it is a very diverse website and i have been having some good success with lots positive comments, and the negative comments were professionally worded comments, not deliberate insults like a lot of the comments on here. .........now i know after what i just left now as a reply to you, i will probably get bashed by the other people on this site. haha i just needed to say what had to be said.
Gavinbas you have no leg to stand on!!! You have a HIGH percentage of positive comments. Sure a few jerks, but nothing to bring on all THIS!
You'll have to forgive me if I do not see the tree in the forest. "I am a typical rockstar?", you trying to act that one out?
And Helter80, your about 50/50 with positive comments! What pushed your percentages HIGH in the negative area was a HIGH level of ambiance in the "people I see" song. Omit all those and your about with Gavinbas
Grow up, the both of ya right now...I mean this instant!
Bunch a BS...who the hello do you think you are and exactly WHAT DID you think you were going to get @ the AW site?
Surely the BC crafted reputation proceeds it? It is, after all, artist WEEKLY!!!
Weekly... your all over that right? It isn't ArtistwhateverJackwants.com or weeklyhand-holding.com.
ArtistWeekly.com!
You guys don't want encouragement if you have to look at yourSELVES to get it...because, just ASK either one of ya, you know what the music world needs...YOUR MUSIC!
You and several hundred thousand other peanut butter sandwiche cookies!
listen jack, (and i 100% say this chuckling, not to offend, but i can't help it) but i can't figure out your metaphors for the life of me. peanut butter sandwiche cookies? I'll take 80 and the stones? what the heck are you talking about? but anyway, the typical rock star song was me messing around with my buddies, and i thought it was pretty ironic, in that the chord structure (if you listen closely) never does deviate from two chords, and i really DO repeat every line twice, but none of it is for clarity or simplicity, its to make fun of the crappy formatted song that everyone is always trying to write. anyway, the real problem, (i've been milling over this for a couple of days now) and i think this is the best way to describe it. for convenience we define our music tastes into two distinct pools. good music and bad music. i like, and i don't like. i dig, i change the station. this is fine for everyday listeners, but anytime there is a dichotemy of categories that excludes the other you get this automatic hierarchy set up. "i like" is inherently "better" than "i don't like" and everybody else should only listen to what "i like" so i'm gonna trash everything else, and be strictly loyal to the ways i define what i like, like genre's, associates of the bands, or simply the radio station i hear it on. turns out this is really rudimentary, pretty childish, and almost always wrong. the same effects are seen throughout history with white supremacy (sorry if that phrase made anybody frown, but thats the word i chose), because we have white, and non-white, or rich and poor, and we can't get past it. the "reality" is that each song is a conglomerate of several different types of strategies or styles or whatever, and each has its own merit for some situations and does bad in other situations. there is no "good" and "bad and certainly not "better." what we look for, is not hand holding or "whateverjackwants.com" but real advice by real musicians. i could care less what percentage of positive comments i receive, me having lots of good criticism does not mean lots of positive reveiws, it means having REAL reviews with valid criticism and/or praise. the only comments i've gotten in the last three or four weeks are, (and i QUOTE) "lame" "what an idiot" "barffffff" and finally, "you need a voice mic...this started so good then went mediocre...then it just all went to hell after that...you need better mics...for the voice if nuthin' else ya'll" which is years better than the other reviews i listed there, but it still pales in comparison to one i got at garageband a few days ago: " Great chorus but please keep it acoustic... A very nice live recording this one, a good quality one too.
Fantastic chorus, and I bet there's a temptation to add all sorts of instruments/drums etc and go for the big American Indie track, but please don't, I think you could have a big hit here if you did that, but then you'd be making it sound like everything else that comes out of America at the moment, this acoustic version is lovely, especially with the lead guitar in the middle, it kind of reminds me of Snowpatrol who are an English band (don't know if you know them?), a bit like a Coldplay.
In terms of suggestions, if you do want to go for the big radio-friendly hit, then a soft overdrive on the verse turning into a nice meaty overdriven hook for the chorus with the regular beat again on the verse and a nice load of hi Hat and cymbals for the Chorus should do the job. If you want to stay left of the middle a little bit, I reckon going for just an alternative 2 string guitar 2 beats on the lower string and two on the higher string, then breaking into a full downstroke for the chorus. I reckon an nice three string hook on the lead might sound lovely on the Chorus and really bring out the vocals. For something different on the middle eight, i reckon a harmonica might sound nice and a bit unexpected.
The Chorus is great, very easy lyrics, feel-good and memorable melody, as I say a three string hook on the lead would really bring this out nicely, try a 'D' shape on each of the friends until you find the harmonic and that should do you nicely!
Well done, very nice song Reviewed by: recklessgeneral from United Kingdom"
Notice how he clearly defines what HE likes, what the POP world would like, an allows me to make the decision as to what to do, because music is all about expression and doing whatever the heck you want with your music, not finding that great "big radio-friendly hit" if you don't want to.
all in all, i don't think helter and i are the ones being immature in this situation. there are clear ways of being professional, and artist weekly doesn't frequently deliver it.
Ever argue with an idiot before? After a short while it is difficult to tell who is the reasonable one of the two:) We may be at that point.
When I hear "experimental music" I think to myself, I say "self, here comes another one that has not paid any dues, does not know how to play, has not listened to and learned anything from anybody and is about to get on my ass about how I do not understand the misunderstood experimental music the artist has presented to me."
And that my brother is bs.
Experimental music is a gift from the hand of the God you believe in only given to a small few. The early days of jazz was divine intervention...[:)
Experimental is bold, sonically orgasmic, unheard of styles and themes nuance and motif.
The rest of it is music crafted, by and large, from the music you were raised on directly AND indirectly. What your Mother and Father listened to...your sisters and brothers...your friends even.
That is where you and I and many many many other people are.
You want to see experimental? Craft a good song,sing like you mean it and play it like it is the only song you have ever written and record it like it is the last one you will ever do and it is going to be aired on TV as well!
Because anything LESS then that makes >you< sound unprofessional and rattles the cage of the AW dogs.
It's like they say "crap in...crap out." People who send AW crap and expect more then crap back usually need an adjustment of some type.
And while I am on it, why is it that by and large the large majority of AW visitors want these kinds of change, to make AW like garageband and tuneoftheweek and myspace, et al?
So you can feel comfortable and keep on doing the same old junk that you been doing and passing off as music?
Why is it that, before entering AW, it is a viable outlet to showcase your work, but as time passes after entry(a few weeks) it is nothing less then footfungis in the shadow of other music related websites?
Now who is getting bitter here?
About the best description I can give of how I have seen the AW collective respond to songs in ANY given week is this, "him what smelt it...dealt it"!
let me tell you something Jack, whoever the hell you are and whoever the hell you think you are...... I've let this post go and not said a word about anything on the subject in days because I do not care anymore, but you gotta continue to keep posting BS. So tell me Mr. Know It All, you have a minipulating answer for everything, so think of something smart for this question. How come you have the nerve to call me an idiot? Hmm, it is quite evident that you yourself are the idiot. I'll tell you flat out. You have the nerve to post bull**** remarks, and minipulate things to make yourself sound like you are right with this scenario. Bottom line, you and the *sshole unprofessional judges are pathetic. Oh, and here is one for the road, "I am not one that has paid his dues" -what you said. Well guess what Jack... I have. I have toured up and down the east coast for 3 months in my last band, I myself was in charge of all the promoting, booking, and dealing with self righteous "hotshots" as yourself. You see the problem with people like you is, you will never face up to anything with an open mind, and you and all of the other *sshole critics here are just flat out pompous. (Not all of the critics here are *ssholes, but there are quite a lot) Oh and by the way smartass, lets hear some of your music. Is it good enough? Or is it too good to post here on AW ? Also, there has been a posting on myspacemusic about this website and its rediculous critics. -Just to keep you informed, what goes around comes around.
All in all, I'm sure you will write back to this with some of your brainstorming bull**** for a comeback, but I do not really have the time nor patience anymore. That is why I haven't reposted to anything on this forum in days until I saw your sweet little post.
P.S. Take your own advice from what you said before "crap in.....crap out".
I have not said a bad word even close to you. I have been bending over backwards to get you people to understand, it IS what it IS...and you cannot change that, get used to it, its been that way and will remain that way.
-- Edited by Jack at 00:48, 2007-08-02
P.S. I edited this message in the spirit of good Will. He was my Uncle and wanted what was best for me. What was best for me was my inheritance!!!! Thanks Uncle Bill!!
99% of the song comments at AW are by anonymous peers. There's a good side to that ...
I agree, but simply because the mojority of the listeners don't take the time to listen to any more than 3 or 4 seconds before they cast judgment and become ardent fans or violently opposed to the artist making any more music, then they let you know (sometimes rudely and without reason as to why or why not) what their first impression was without restrain. This can be very valuable i think. Its also frutrating here because you won't more than 4 ratings unless your first ratings are at least 4 and half, so then your entries just sit there, and any attention you bring to it seems to raise backlash in the community (wink facebook wink) oh yeah helter, theres a whole thread on when i first dealt with my frustration with this site a few months ago, but anyway, the few that do rate it rarely take the time to actually say anything, so it really comes down to laziness. it seems that musicians are just too lazy, critical, cutthroat and unprofessional to have a majorly ungoverned musical community that involves criticism and anonymous or unnacountable feedback.
as for what is experimental msuic and what is actually already developed music in disguise is a pretty silly notion to me, isn't the word experimental used for the very purpose of denoting without rules, without boundaries? so isn't melding, mixing, developing and continuing traditions of music just as experimental as someone using random sounds and breaking all the rules? the truth is we are just too stuck on labels to use indiviudal merits of musical endeavours to categorize them for specific instances, which is really all we can do. We can say, well this would do well in this club or opening or this band, but it would be better in that setting if whatever whatever were changed, or well, this would never do at a folk festival, because it's not an acoustic guitar and singer with harmonica, but if you want to continue your style maybe it would work in the whatever vein if you tweaked this or this a bit this way or that way.
finally, where'd everybody go on this discussion? why do the ones that i actually like talking about always dwindle down to me and jack? what do other forum goers think about this? am i wrong? do i dare ask for *cough* feedback (haha) about my posts?
I feel your pain (haha). Ok, on the one hand, anonymity yields uninhibited, honest comments, but on the other, it opens the door to unwarrented insults. But, like Jack said, just take the good with the bad, use what's helpful and don't let the rest ruin your day. All in all, it is much better then sitting around holding hands, calling each other awesome. By the way, I think we should all be more open minded towards music that doesn't suit our convention, e.g., Richard Ringer, who I think is something special, but no one else here sees it that way ...
