Can You Produce a Hit Song

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Can You Produce a Hit Song

Date: Jun 8, 2006

We appreciate the participation Steve, but maybe you could start the discussion here instead of sending people to another board to discuss......

Date: Jun 8, 2006

I think you missed the part of my post that asked

"So what do you think?"

And Gearslutz and Artist Weekly are poles apart in terms of content. One's for engineers, producer types...basically gear slutz... and AW is for song writers.

Am I wrong about that?

So the question still stands

Can you PRODUCE a hit (as in using Production tools)? Or are the elements of a hit song in it before production happens?

Date: Jun 8, 2006

This was posted there and is kind of how I feel.

"First, a good song is a good song regardless of production. A good song is an opinion.

An average song can sound much better with a good recording and good production. That's not hard to believe...

However, neither of those two things garuntee a hit song. Marketing may help but let's be specific about that. There's no such thing as shoving something down someone's throat until they eventually like it. Marketing does NOT do that! If you sink 10 million dollars into promoting a single, that ten million simply allows you to reach more POTENTIAL buyers. Of course not everyone will like what you're selling, but selling is a numbers game. Like someone mentioned earlier, the number of record sales considered to be a successful campaign is WAY lower than the total population. Let's face it, I write crappy music...I've written a few good songs too. As an indie musician I have a small group of supporters who always buy my albums and pre order new ablums. Now, if I was independently wealthy, I could start a marketing campaign to reach all the other folks out there who would like my stuff too. If out of 270 million people, I can get 10 million sales, two things happen..1, I'm even more wealthy because my investment became successful and 2, I probably just made myself somewhat famous. You have to have money to make money and that's what the larger labels have that us indie guys don't. Don't get hung up on what is publicaly considered a success...That song "Hey Ya" by Outkast I HATE! I think it's stupid and makes me feel like I pooped my pants. But what's my opinion worth? The record label simply "found" millions of people who like it through marketing. And that simple fact makes it a hit?? A hit only means numbers.....not your opinion of good song / bad song. Hell, if I was independently wealthy, you'd see me selling my albums on billboards, TV and everywhere Elvis keeps showing up...whether you liked it or not!

One last thing from the record company's perspective.. If you were going to put millions of bucks into a marketing campaign who would you choose to sign? The artist with ok songs, maybe improved by production, or the artist that has not so great songs, maybe improved by production, but looks like a swimsuit model? What choice do you really have? By signing the beautiful woman, you'll get more people to look / listen to the music, which means more potential buyers. Even if the music sucks you still get more POTENTIAL buyers. It's strictly an investment, nothing pesonal, nothing to do with opinions of musical quality. It's all about maximizing profit with the individual who appeals to the wider audience. From a business perspective, the choice is a no brainer. Does that hurt the quality of music released to the masses? In my opinion yes...But apparently it's what the majority of the world wants.

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Good question Steve with multiple answers I am certain. For me I have to exclude the notion of to what level the song can reach in order to be a hit, if it ever gets that predictable please unplug me. I believe you really can "produce" a hit from average work. It helps to be an established artist as we have all seen. Then again can we talk about hit without including The Dark side of the moon? Not a single releashed from it but is still the most popular rock album worldwide. But I recess.

How well did the boy bands of the Nineties do? Pretty good if I remember. Chicks loved them. That was production at its finest, with the marketing power to , ah, produce.

What about Elton Johns "Candle in the wind"? Good song, but marginal as a hit. But when re-recorded with lyrics about the tragic death of Lady Di in 1997, it became the fastest selling, number one hit. And remains the number one "hit" of all time if my sources are correct, or at least close:) But I digest.

I guess I cannot find the answer I thought was in me. Yea, sometimes those smart folks can just "produce" something from nothing(wish I had an example)OH OH, Billy Cyrus, achy breaky heart! They had to have suffered over trying to make that what it turned out to be.

Man, that's it for me on this right now, I think I hurt myself.

Jack

Date: Jun 8, 2006

Seems topical Steve, at least as one of the building blocks.

What makes a song catchy?

"You could hear a song 25 times a day. If it has a short refrain that everyone can remember, it will stick, even if it's terrible."

Date: Jun 8, 2006

...opened in a new window yes, but went nowhere....

What makes a song catchy?

Date: Jun 9, 2006

God, I've heard so many songs I thought were terrible and because I heard them sooo many times on the radio...well, I "caught" them.

I guess that means they were catchy.

There's a current one by Christina Aguilera called 'Ain't No Other Man'

It's not what I'd call catchy to the masses and it seems it could be a future Hit song that was "Produced" (i.e. no one's gonna sing it on open mic night").

But it's not a Hit yet, so...????

Date: Jun 9, 2006

I don't think I could produce a 'hit' to honestly answer your question. I don't have the resources. But whether a song is a 'hit' or not would not be up to me. Too many factors, as has been discussed here, come into play.

Can I write 'good' songs? I'd like to think so. But that's my opinion. While it may be shared by some, many or just one other person - it's still just an opinion. And it means that I can also write 'bad' songs.

I like being indie - there's more freedom and control. If I don't feel like adding a 'catchy' hook or chorus - it doesn't make its way in. Will I sell less records because of it? Perhaps. It all depends on the consumer opinion.

Date: Jun 10, 2006

brad -- I totally disagree with you: You can produce a hit song. I recently started listening to "Last Hello, Goodbye" again (probably 25x in the last couple days) and it is one of the most original and heartfelt relationship songs I have ever heard. Like the previous post said, a good song is a good song regardless of production, and the more I listen the more I'm convinced that you've written a very good song.

Yes 820, I'm gushing. And no, I don't want to marry him. Go jump in a lake.

Date: Jun 11, 2006

Gotta agree with BC about "Last Hello, Goodbye" by Brad

Wished I'd written that one. (No mystery why it won that week at AW.)

Could that song be Produced more than it is to even make it more effective...I think it could.

When Brad told me about John Mayer's 'Comfortable' I checked it out, I could guess that song, at its inception, sounded much like Brad's does now. But with the added strings and added vocal harmonies the song really brings me from beginning to end a lot easier. And is more effective in my opinion.

Date: Jun 12, 2006

Steve - I know what you mean. I don't look at 'Last Hello, Goodbye' as being a 'finished' product. I actually have a trumpet part for it, but suffice to say, it's... different. Didn't make the recording. Maybe I'll do something more on it when I get some green.

Funny story - the song was written, literally, in minutes after I watched this indie flick about the end of the world - 'Last Night' - with Sandra Oh. I sometimes get impulsive and write things like this, but then I'm very undisciplined and can't go back and work on them. SO - the plan is to try to produce this thing more. I have some decent ideas, some good suggestions from fellow songwriters here and elsewhere, and I think I can make it even better. I'd love for it to end up in a film somewhere. I guess that's the mindset I was in when I wrote it.

Thanks to all for the tremendous support.

Date: Jun 12, 2006

Brad ...

You certainly don't need to hear this from me but all encouragment is worthwhile in my humble opinion, so ...

Whether the song makes it into a film someday or not, it is definitely worthy of being in a film, at the least, and that's what counts. I don't profess to be an expert by any stretch but there are qualities in the lyrics, the song structure and so forth that reveal a very unique and deep talent nestled in that creative mind of yours. Keep putting yourself out there ... people are going to recognize what you have and that's how it all gets started. The fact that I felt compelled to write this is evidence of that. Best of luck to you.

Date: Jun 12, 2006

So, has the question been answered yet?

Date: Jun 13, 2006

Well, in that there's no one answer - it hasn't been answered yet.

But I think for me, it now boils down to:

Production, solely, a hit song does not make

But it helps.

To muddle it up even more, go here

http://www.myspace.com/motherofdestiny

And listen to 'Leaving Town'...demo and then produced. Which do you like?

(Sorry, 820, for sending them away from AW)

Date: Jul 8, 2006

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